Harold Underdown is an editor and host of the Purple Crayon website, a comprehensive resource for children’s lit creators. He’s also the author of The Complete Idiot’s Guide to Publishing Children’s Books. During his time as Executive Editor at Kane Press he was the editor for David Rickert’s upcoming graphic novel Checkups, Shots, and Robots. David is an Ohio-based author-illustrator whose first graphic novel, Pizza, Pickles, and Apple Pie was also edited by Harold and published by Kane Press. They’ve teamed up to talk about their editorial process. Thank you, Harold and David!
For David: What did your pitch/proposal to Harold look like for Checkups, Shots, and Robots?
David: It was the second book in a two book deal, so the pitch was based on my first book Pizza, Pickles, and Apple Pie. I had included the concept for Checkups, Shots, and Robots as a possible second title. For my pitch I included a few pages of finished art, some tight pencils of a few other pages, summaries of foods I wanted to include (many of which didn’t make it into the final book), some comp titles, and possible sequels. My agent, Janna Morishima, was a big help in pulling it all together in an attractive package.
How was it working with an editor on your project?
David: I needed one! There’s no way I could have ever self published. For one thing, it’s great to have someone help make your prose leaner and efficient because I’m not good at that. I’m also not a detail person, so I needed someone to work with me on finding the little things that were amiss—coloring issues, tangents, and so forth. Mainly, it was a relief to have someone that understood what kind of book I wanted to make and what needed to happen to make it the book that I had in me, especially when I didn’t see it.
What were the biggest changes you made from the first book to the second?
David: I wanted Checkups, Shots, and Robots to cover all the reasons why a kid might go to the doctor. The chapters came pretty easily, but what would go into those chapters took a little tweaking. In a section about surgery I had included wartime surgery, which didn’t make the cut (no pun intended). I also had a chapter called “Looking Inside” that started with dissection and went through MRIs, but most of that was cut, with the remainder being absorbed into other chapters. So there was a lot of figuring out what should go where until Harold and I had nailed down what we thought was a good sequence.
I will say that one of my goal is always to see diversity in the representation on important people, and I think this book covers that.
Any tips on how to handle the editorial process for a GN creator?
David: Remember that everyone is trying to make your book the best it can be. The process of getting the finished manuscript done along with the finished art is the most frustrating part. You can get a lot of feedback, and it can be overwhelming and discouraging at times. I sometimes wondered if the book was any good because you can completely lose perspective with a lot of feedback coming from various people. You forget what sparked your interest in the book in the first place. But I would eventually remember that there was a reason I got a book deal, and that people wanted to see a great book as much as I did.
For Harold: What piqued your interest in David’s proposal?
Harold: To start with, the subject interested me! That’s essential. If I don’t feel a connection to a story or idea or topic, I’m not going to move forward with it. I agreed to the topic of medicine as we experience it now, and its history, when I signed up David’s first book. As with Pizza, Pickles, and Apple Pie, I could also see the potential for David’s approach of presenting some complex history through a thoughtful blend of stories, explanations, and humor. And I liked the universality of the subject. EVERYONE, even the healthiest among us, has had some experience with our healthcare system, and might be curious about how it got to be what it is today.
How do you approach a project you acquire?
Harold: At the time I acquired David’s two projects, my process was to share the proposal and other materials with our publisher, and discuss it with her, explaining why I was excited about it and how I thought it would work for us. Once I had her go-ahead, I set up a P&L (profit and loss statement—a financial analysis of what it would cost for us to publish the book and how we would make money from it) and an acquisition memo, in which I laid out the case for the acquisition. This included information about the book (or in this case, two proposed books) and its potential market, about David, and about comparable titles (comps). I got a sign off from our company president, and then moved on to negotiating the contract with David’s agent, Janna Morishima.
What editorial approach do you take with graphic novels that’s different from other types of books?
Harold: Is this a trick question? Because I don’t take a different editorial approach. With all the books I work on, I start by working with the author on the text until we both agree it’s ready. Where I step into that process may vary: sometimes I start with a manuscript that’s nearly finished. In other cases, I may be involved at the idea stage. But regardless of the starting point, we go back and forth for as long as is needed. When the text is “done” and has been copyedited, we usually start working on the illustrations, whether the book is a picture book, a graphic novel, or a chapter book with occasional illustrations. And these go through a process too, from sketches to finishes. All along, other people are involved, as needed.
What were the challenges with the project? What were you both most proud of with this project?
Harold: Speaking as the editor, I think the biggest challenge we had was sticking to a tight development schedule while David was also working full-time in his teaching job! I don’t know how he did it. We did change our schedule for Checkups, Shots, and Robots. With Pizza, Pickles, and Apple Pie, we had worked on the book as a whole, or attempted to. We learned that that was not efficient, as the project was passed from author/illustrator to editor to designer to copyeditor, leaving most of the team waiting for it to come back to them. With Checkups, Shots, and Robots we split the project up into the sections the book was divided into, routing each of those separately. This created some complications—we had to keep on top of where everything was!—but it helped us keep things moving. So I can’t point to one particular thing. I’m proud of how the book as a whole turned out, with a great balance of serious information, fascinating stories, and humor that provided just the right level of comic relief.
David: The most challenging part for me was getting the coloring done! It’s not something I really enjoy doing, and unfortunately it’s the last part of the process. And as Harold said, we were up against a tight deadline. But as he said, we had a much better working method for the second book that prevented a lot of the holdups we encountered with Pizza, Pickles, and Apple Pie.
As far as what I’m proud of, I’m really proud of the artwork this time. I think it looks great, and I grew as an illustrator.
What steps of the publication process for Checkups, Shots, and Robots or graphic novels in general would be helpful for new GN creators to understand?
David: It can take a long time to find someone that will take on your project. It took about six months to get Kane Press to express interest, and I had begun thinking of other ideas by then, assuming Pizza, Pickles, and Apple Pie would not make it to print. I also want to stress this: make sure you know the specifications for artwork delivery before you start drawing. Have a conversation with your graphic designer before you start working on the art. Also, know that some things, like the title and cover, are going to be market tested and may change. Checkups, Shots, and Robots was initially called Say Aahh!! And had a completely different cover. Third, there are going to be a lot more people involved in the process than you think. A lot of hands in the process! Be grateful they are there.
What advice would you give to GN creators trying to break into the industry?
David: I got lucky. There’s no other way to put it. I happened to tweet during a Twitter pitchfest, and Janna happened to be on Twitter when I posted. She liked my artwork and my vibe, and not the project I was pitching. But she was interested in anything I might come up with as a proposal. So I would say it’s important to find an editor and agent who believe in you as a creator. Someone who is interested in whatever you might come up with next.
Harold: I’ll just add that luck does come in when you are trying to get started. But you also create your luck by being ready when luck happens—having samples, a portfolio, a professional approach. You can’t just wait for the luck to happen and for you to be “discovered.” David didn’t wait.
For more information about Harold, visit his site, The Purple Crayon, at: https://www.underdown.org
For more information about David, visit: https://davidrickert.com/
For more information about David’s books, visit: https://astrapublishinghouse.com/?s=rickert